| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23] > | 简体中文网页已经上了! (Proz.com has been PARTIALLY localized into Chinese!) Thread poster: Zhoudan
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Wenjer Leuschel (X) 
Taiwan
Local time: 20:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
pkchan wrote:
是不是要考慮『政治正確』的問題，有簡就有繁。不能冷落『繁』人。機器可以代勞嗎？若是可以的話，那就簡單了。
PK,
打開天窗說亮話，這件事上沒有所謂的「政治正確」的問題。我當然也希望能有繁體版的網頁，但依我的經驗，台灣翻譯者大多不太樂意參加意見或參與工作，這使得繁體版的 justification 降低了不少。
我前頭說了，台灣繁體翻譯其實有大量是從簡體轉過來的。這是台灣業者很平常的做法。幾乎 80% 的專利翻譯都是在中國做的，台灣這邊只做繁體轉換後的審校修訂工作。許多台灣的律師樓雇用的翻譯者，其實 90% 的時間都是在做這種轉換審校的工作。
是的，機器可以代勞許多。最終定稿卻必須由人來做。如果這些網頁一定要有繁體版，定稿由你和 Betty 應付，應該綽綽有餘，要不然我再找一兩位幫手跟你們一起做也可以。
- Wenjer
| | | | Chinoise
Local time: 09:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
| Error Report: | Oct 20, 2006 |
Dear Proofreaders (for the Simplified Chinese Localization Project):
In the KudoZ area as well as the ProZ.com Profile section (Simplified Chinese version), " Chinese to Italian" has been translated as "中文汉语翻成意大利" (What a funny mistake!)...
Please correct it accordingly. Thanks a lot in advance!
Regards,
Betty
[修改时间: 2006-10-20 03:33]
| | | | Kevin Yang
Local time: 05:05
Member (2003)
English to Chinese
+ ...
| That was a good catch, Betty! | Oct 20, 2006 |
Chinoise wrote:
Dear Proofreaders (for the Simplified Chinese Localization Project):
In the KudoZ area as well as the ProZ.com Profile section (Simplified Chinese version), " Chinese to Italian" has been translated as "中文汉语翻成意大利" (What a funny mistake!)...
Please correct it accordingly. Thanks a lot in advance!
Regards,
Betty
Betty,
Thank you for the good catch! I just fixed it.
There are a couple known issues:
1. The Chinese font size in certain areas are too small to read.
2. The bold Chinese characters are not legible.
3. English words, sentences, buttons are still in Englsih (I am reporting them page by page).
For the localized text, I can fix it right away by myself, so please keep posting your reports. Dongjun also emailed me his defect report. I think you for your effort. I noticed the slow response to my 2nd round of localization call. I hope I can get enough people to assign the files.
I have been looking at the localized Chinese web pages and enjoying looking at them very much.
Kevin
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Kevin Yang
Local time: 05:05
Member (2003)
English to Chinese
+ ...
| It is my dream to have both SCH and TCH interfaces. | Oct 20, 2006 |
pkchan wrote:
是不是要考慮『政治正確』的問題，有簡就有繁。不能冷落『繁』人。機器可以代勞嗎？若是可以的話，那就簡單了。
PK,
Thank you for bringing up the TCH localization request! Well, I did not forget you and other TCH readers. At this moment, I am tryting to convert Wenjer into a SCH reader, hopfully I will be successful.
I proposed to start with the SCH localization, mainly because there are more SCH members and users here to read SCH and help with the SCH localization. We are taking SCH as a trial version, and hope it will be successful. Then, I will definately push for TCH version. Right now, I have to push hard to get the SCH localization moving forward. Can you imagine what I will be like if the TCH localization is also undertaking at the same time?
For some strange reason, I do not see many translators from Hong Kong and Taiwan come here and explore this wonderful site and networking with the wonderful people here. I wonder if there are not many translators in Taiwan and Hong Kong? Or they think we are not user-friendly to the translators from Taiwan and Hong Kong? I hope my Hong Kong Pal Angus Woo can give me some inputs.
A couple days ago, I had chance to talk about the Chinese sector with Henry, the founder of this website. He happily informed me that the Chinese sector has been the fastest growing sector at ProZ.com. He is very pleased with the development of our sector. He thanked you all for for your good work and participation here.
It is my dream to have both SCH and TCH interfaces running at this website. Considering the manpower and resources, we just have to do the SCH version for now.
Kevin
[修改时间: 2006-10-20 05:31]
| | | | redred
China
Local time: 20:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
| Waiting his inputs... | Oct 20, 2006 |
TongliUSA wrote:
For some strange reason, I do not see many translators from Hong Kong and Taiwan come here and explore this wonderful site and networking with the wonderful people here. I wonder if there are not many translators in Taiwan and Hong Kong? Or they think we are not user-friendly to the translators from Taiwan and Hong Kong? I hope my Hong Kong Pal Angus Woo can give me some inputs.
Kevin
[修改时间: 2006-10-20 05:31]
I think our fellow Hong Kong compatriot, Angus Woo, he would be no problem to share a same interface with us, whatever language variance inherited from our ancestors, we are of the same root and origin forever, it can’t barricade us to communicate.
| | | | Wenjer Leuschel (X)
Taiwan
Local time: 20:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
| You must be kidding. | Oct 20, 2006 |
TongliUSA wrote:
... At this moment, I am tryting to convert Wenjer into a SCH reader, hopfully I will be successful.
Hi Kevin,
You must be kidding. I am also a SCH reader. You can imaging how many SCH characters I need to read each day, though I write mostly in TCH.
You see, I am not against having TCH pages at all. I am just wondering if it is necessary, since almost all of the Chinese translators read SCH and TCH. However, if it shall be kind of "P" correctness to have TCH pages, you may count on me. I will be quite willing to contribute my TCH knowledge in the project so much as the time I have.
Actually, I am as puzzled as you are to find out that there are not many Taiwanese translators coming up to this wonderful website. My guess would be: They are too busy in sustaining with a rate of NTD 0.60 to NTD 1.50 per source word (exchange rate for USD and NTD is about 1:33). However, I will try to get some coming up here. There are two team of Taiwanese translators, each with 4 members, doing projects for me with a rate of NTD 2.00 to NTD 2.50 per source word. For Chinese into English/German, the rate would be NTD 2.50 to NTD 6.00 in very rare cases.
There will be soon the 3rd Powwow Meeting in Taiwan. Charlie Peng (Dr. Peng) and I will make sure that there will be some more Taiwanese translators coming up to ProZ.com.
Have a nice weekend!
- Wenjer
| | | | pkchan
United States
Local time: 08:05
Member (2006)
English to Chinese
+ ...
Wenjer Leuschel wrote:
pkchan wrote:
是不是要考慮『政治正確』的問題，有簡就有繁。不能冷落『繁』人。機器可以代勞嗎？若是可以的話，那就簡單了。
PK,
打開天窗說亮話，這件事上沒有所謂的「政治正確」的問題。我當然也希望能有繁體版的網頁，但依我的經驗，台灣翻譯者大多不太樂意參加意見或參與工作，這使得繁體版的 justification 降低了不少。
我前頭說了，台灣繁體翻譯其實有大量是從簡體轉過來的。這是台灣業者很平常的做法。幾乎 80% 的專利翻譯都是在中國做的，台灣這邊只做繁體轉換後的審校修訂工作。許多台灣的律師樓雇用的翻譯者，其實 90% 的時間都是在做這種轉換審校的工作。
是的，機器可以代勞許多。最終定稿卻必須由人來做。如果這些網頁一定要有繁體版，定稿由你和 Betty 應付，應該綽綽有餘，要不然我再找一兩位幫手跟你們一起做也可以。
- Wenjer
文哲兄﹕若不是「政治正確」的問題，又不是看不看懂簡體字的問題，又不是『繁簡辯』的問題，但又想吸引更多『繁』人參加PROZ，如不啟動『繁體化』，還有什麼其他方法呢？或許會說『繁人』已成為『頻臨絕種』了，可以不理他們，那我就無話可說了。想聽聽你的意見。老陳
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Wenjer Leuschel (X)
Taiwan
Local time: 20:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
| 語文反映的是怎樣的現實？ | Oct 20, 2006 |
pkchan wrote:
文哲兄﹕若不是「政治正確」的問題，又不是看不看懂簡體字的問題，又不是『繁簡辯』的問題，但又想吸引更多『繁』人參加PROZ，如不啟動『繁體化』，還有什麼其他方法呢？或許會說『繁人』已成為『頻臨絕種』了，可以不理他們，那我就無話可說了。想聽聽你的意見。老陳
Rom 2:28 For he is not a Jew, which is one outwardly; neither [is that] circumcision, which is outward in the flesh:
Rom 2:29 But he [is] a Jew, which is one inwardly; and circumcision [is that] of the heart, in the spirit, [and] not in the letter; whose praise [is] not of men, but of God.
這兩段新約聖經羅馬書第二章的文字，不知對你有什麼意義；對我卻一直很有意義。我可以是地球人，我可以是台灣人，我可以說家鄉的言語，我可以說中國的普通話，我也可以說英語、德語、西班牙語，在我的半生裡仍然遇到不少次不受尊重的情況，但卻從來沒有失去我對自己的認識，因為認同是一種對人的尊重，不管那些人是否尊重你，在乎的是心，在乎的是靈，不在乎儀文。
你我大多時候都是寫繁體字的，但其實只要改換一下輸入系統，寫出來的就是簡體字，可是人的思想內容、內涵因此改變了嗎？
對我而言，繁體化的網頁可有可無，但對台灣、香港和中國大陸的稱法，我則有一定的看法，別人怎麼稱都無妨，現實的情況是：「香港(中國)」是現狀，「中華民國」或「台灣」是現狀，「中華人民共和國」則是「中國共產黨」所代表的「中國」或「中國大陸」的現狀。
如果連 ProZ.com 的網頁也要反映中文世界的現狀，給香港人看的中文版是否應該是一種不同的繁體字網頁？給台灣人看的又是另一種不同的繁體字網頁？
嗯，你說這像不像為了出虛恭而脫下褲子？是因為怕褲子臭嗎？我看不是吧？
| | | | Chinoise
Local time: 09:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
| Thanks for your quick response! | Oct 20, 2006 |
Kevin,
I thought there might be two or three people helping with the proofreading task (since one or two of them did mention here that they had proofread some of the files), but now I realize currently you are the only one proofing all the files translated by us. That must be a lot of work. We appreciate all the time you have invested in making the Chinese Localization possible. If, by any chance, the Traditional Chinese Localization project takes place in the near future, count us ... See more Kevin,
I thought there might be two or three people helping with the proofreading task (since one or two of them did mention here that they had proofread some of the files), but now I realize currently you are the only one proofing all the files translated by us. That must be a lot of work. We appreciate all the time you have invested in making the Chinese Localization possible. If, by any chance, the Traditional Chinese Localization project takes place in the near future, count us in, too. I can at least proofread some of the pages, though TCH is not my forte. Redred is quite right in saying that Angus Woo, PKChan and many other TCH experts from Hong Kong and Taiwan are always willing to help us in both SCH and TCH localization projects. Nice people, aren't they?
Just like others, I 'm more than happy to know that our most respectable senior colleague, Yueyin, will also join our team. His professionalism is admired by all. Thanks again to Stonejohn and other team members for their voluntary work done in the past months. Now I can deeply understand why you (and other colleagues) mentioned so many times in the Chinese forum that you are in desperate need of more people residing in different time zones to help with the vetting work here, given the fact that we are such a large language population (probably the largest in the world) and there are so many Chinese people visiting and making all kinds of posts here that you cannot vet all of them in time (partly due to the time difference, too). Besides, some peers, especially the newbies, post whatever they like to say here (including their personal complaints) without reading the ProZ.com forum rules beforehand, which clearly stipulate that “Postings which are political, religious, or otherwise controversial in nature, or that may be considered offensive by other users, will be removed without regard to the views expressed.”(cf http://www.proz.com/forumrules/ , http://www.proz.com/scope). Should any assistance be needed regarding these issues, we are always here to help (I learned from your reply to PK that you and Henry just had a pleasant talk with respect to the significant growth in the number of the site users from our language group. Good news, isn't it?)
Back to the Chinese Localization Project. For the time being, I/We will keep reporting errors to you and other proofreaders (if any) here until the SCH version is officially released to the public (Non-team members are definitely welcome to give their valuable comments on the errors reported here). Nothing is perfect and no translation is impeccable. However, we can always strive to be perfect until the translation looks perfect in our own eyes. That said, we'd better be “faultfinding” with our own work before others could have a chance to be fastidious about our “final product” (due to our poor translation quality)…
TongliUSA wrote:
Betty,
Thank you for the good catch! I just fixed it.
There are a couple known issues:
1. The Chinese font size in certain areas are too small to read.
2. The bold Chinese characters are not legible.
3. English words, sentences, buttons are still in Englsih (I am reporting them page by page).
For the localized text, I can fix it right away by myself, so please keep posting your reports. Dongjun also emailed me his defect report. I think you for your effort. I noticed the slow response to my 2nd round of localization call. I hope I can get enough people to assign the files.
I have been looking at the localized Chinese web pages and enjoying looking at them very much.
Kevin
redred wrote:
I think our fellow Hong Kong compatriot, Angus Woo, he would be no problem to share a same interface with us, whatever language variance inherited from our ancestors, we are of the same root and origin forever, it can’t barricade us to communicate.
[修改时间: 2006-10-21 14:53] ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Yes, we did proofread the files. | Oct 20, 2006 |
Betty,
The translated files, I believe, were all proofread by participating translators on an availability basis. For example, before delivery to Kevin, Wenjer, Donglai and I, proposed by Wenjer and discussed and agreed by all three of us through MSN conferencing that we should proofread among ourselves to alleviate Kevin and other translators' burden. Therefore, we exchanged files - Wenjer proofread my translation; Donglai proofread Wenjer's translation; I proofread Donglai's trans... See more Betty,
The translated files, I believe, were all proofread by participating translators on an availability basis. For example, before delivery to Kevin, Wenjer, Donglai and I, proposed by Wenjer and discussed and agreed by all three of us through MSN conferencing that we should proofread among ourselves to alleviate Kevin and other translators' burden. Therefore, we exchanged files - Wenjer proofread my translation; Donglai proofread Wenjer's translation; I proofread Donglai's translation. Later, Kevin sent me your translation for proofreading.
However, unfortunately, I was not able to help him after that due to the amount of work I received from clients. Indeed, localization is not the same as translation. And there are all kinds of errors due to various reasons, such as unfamiliarity with the website interface, lack of experience, etc., to quote just a few. Besides, the localization, as many colleagues expressed, is an on-going process. And the website is to be continunously improved and updated. Of course, it is unfair that Kevin is to shoulder all of these responsibilities. And it is also no rush work. In my opnion, the CHT job can only be started until CHS localization is near-perfect. Because they are basically Chinese and shouldn't be so different other than in some particular areas, such as terms, etc. If we lay a good foundation in CHS project, CHT localization could be rather smooth and easy.
As to vetting posts, I believe Kevin has been trying very hard to ensure most postings are displayed before all of us and a freedom of speech advocated. I think he wants to maintain a harmonious environment for all of us and as a new moderator, I admit I have a lot to learn from him. Actually I've studying his way of dealing with different postings since I obtained access to moderation rights and thinking about why he did this or that. I think I can feel his decision-making process as of a mild and considerate mode. Comparing with my inexperienced and direct handling of a few cases, his way is much more superior.
And as a matter of fact, there are not sooooooooooooooo many postings as will make Kevin out of control. He's rather capable of the work and he works hard and never sleeps tight . I believe he's able to handle the Chinese forum single-handed very well.
Best Regards,
Jianjun
Chinoise wrote:
Kevin,
I thought there might be two or three people helping with the proofreading task (since one or two of them did mention here that they had proofread some of the files), but now I realize currently you are the only one proofing all the files translated by us. That must be a lot of work. We appreciate all the time you have invested in making the Chinese Localization possible. If, by any chance, the Traditional Chinese Localization project takes place in the near future, count us in, too. I can at least proofread some of the pages, though TCH is not my forte. Redred is quite right in saying that Angus Woo, PKChan and many other TCH experts from Hong Kong and Taiwan are always willing to help us in both SCH and TCH localization projects. Nice people, aren't they?
Just like others, I 'm more than happy to know that our most respectable senior colleague, Yueyin, will also join our team. His professionalism is admired by all. Thanks again to Stonejohn and other team members for their voluntary work in the past months. Now I can deeply understand why you (and other colleagues) mentioned so many times in the Chinese forum that you are in desperate need of more people residing in different time zones to help with the vetting work here, given the fact that we are such a large language population (probably the largest in the world) and there are so many Chinese people visiting and making all kinds of posts here that you cannot vet all of them in time (partly due to the time difference, too). Besides, some peers, especially the newbies, post whatever they like to say here (including their personal complaints) without reading the ProZ.com forum rules beforehand, which clearly stipulate that “Postings which are political, religious, or otherwise controversial in nature, or that may be considered offensive by other users, will be removed without regard to the views expressed.”(cf http://www.proz.com/forumrules/ , http://www.proz.com/scope). Should any assistance be needed regarding these issues, we are always here to help (I learned from your reply to PK that you and Henry just had a pleasant talk with respect to the significant growth in the number of the site users from our language group. Good news, isn't it?)
Back to the Chinese Localization Project. For the time being, I/We will keep reporting errors to you and other proofreaders (if any) here until the SCH version is officially released to the public (Non-team members are definitely welcome to give their valuable comments on the errors reported here). Nothing is perfect and no translation is impeccable. However, we can always strive to be perfect until the translation looks perfect in our own eyes. That said, we'd better be “faultfinding” with our own work before others could have a chance to be fastidious about our “final product” (due to our poor translation quality)…
TongliUSA wrote:
Betty,
Thank you for the good catch! I just fixed it.
There are a couple known issues:
1. The Chinese font size in certain areas are too small to read.
2. The bold Chinese characters are not legible.
3. English words, sentences, buttons are still in Englsih (I am reporting them page by page).
For the localized text, I can fix it right away by myself, so please keep posting your reports. Dongjun also emailed me his defect report. I think you for your effort. I noticed the slow response to my 2nd round of localization call. I hope I can get enough people to assign the files.
I have been looking at the localized Chinese web pages and enjoying looking at them very much.
Kevin
redred wrote:
I think our fellow Hong Kong compatriot, Angus Woo, he would be no problem to share a same interface with us, whatever language variance inherited from our ancestors, we are of the same root and origin forever, it can’t barricade us to communicate. [修改时间: 2006-10-20 18:49] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Kevin Yang
Local time: 05:05
Member (2003)
English to Chinese
+ ...
| I am so grateful to have the supporters like you two. | Oct 20, 2006 |
Hello, Betty and Jianjun
So wonderful to read your comments and suggestions! I am so grateful to have the supporters to my work and the SCH localization project like you two.
Betty: Thank you for the understanding and continuous contribution! The system is setup in a way that I am the only one who is authorized to do the final editing to the online translation files. Your way of reporting the errors by posting them here works very well. I am here asking other team membe... See more Hello, Betty and Jianjun
So wonderful to read your comments and suggestions! I am so grateful to have the supporters to my work and the SCH localization project like you two.
Betty: Thank you for the understanding and continuous contribution! The system is setup in a way that I am the only one who is authorized to do the final editing to the online translation files. Your way of reporting the errors by posting them here works very well. I am here asking other team members to do the same. Please do not stop or think it is all done, or you have done your portion of the contribution. We are not there yet. We have not fulfilled our commitment as long as the SCH version is not released. Please take pledge again and get ready for the 2nd round of translation. While waiting for your pledge, I have been translating online as much as I can. Yes, right now it seems everything fell on my shoulder. Well, I know you are there and will consider helping again. Yes, we have to get the SCH version up-runing first and proof we can do it with team effort and with the quality that stands for any challenges, before we can even consider to start the TCH version.
Jianjun: Thank you for thinking me highly. No one is born to be a moderator. It took me over a year to learn how to do the job by keeping everyone happy while getting the job done right. Our peers support and understanding made/make/will make everything easier. Besides all that, I am here to help you whenever you need me. Don't let it burden you, but enjoy it and make it fun. You can do it. I have the trust in you.
Yes, all the translations have been proofread before we uploaded them into the server. But, what we had in the translation files cannot reflect well what they actually look like after the translation files have been uploaded into the server and become the localized web pages. So, the best and the most effective proofreading is performed by clicking on each link and go to each page to review the current translation text. Right now, I only have one pair of eyes and limited time to do such work, I need to mobilize everyone to do this job and report the defects to me.
Ciao!
Kevin
[修改时间: 2006-10-20 21:11] ▲ Collapse
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Chinoise
Local time: 09:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
| One Question for Discussion : | Oct 20, 2006 |
Hi SCH Proofreaders and all,
Throughout the localized texts, the word "Chinese" (referring to "the Chinese language" here) has been translated as "中文汉语". It sounds a bit redundant to me . Would it be possible to change it to either “中文” or “汉语”？Any suggestions, folks?
Thanks in advance!
Regards,
Betty
[修改时间: 2006-10-20 21:59]
| | | | Chinoise
Local time: 09:05
English to Chinese
+ ...
| Question Solved. | Oct 20, 2006 |
I was so glad to find the following link right on this site:
http://www.proz.com/kudoz/114698
Throughout the localized texts, the word "Chinese" (referring to "the Chinese language" here) has been translated as "中文汉语". It sounds a bit redundant to me . Would it be possible to change it to either “中文” or “汉语”？Any suggestions, folks?
Thanks in advance!
Regards,
Betty
| | | | | Review of whole file | Oct 21, 2006 |
This is indeed strange. If I don't get it wrong, I believe this languages file was done by some machine translation.
I also found Pidgin in all cases was translated as 洋泾浜, which is surely incorrect in this context.. I suggest a thorough review of the languages file.
Kevin I found this sentence in Kudoz interface:
KudoZ网络为译员和他人提供一个互动的架构，让大家互相帮助，完美翻译和解释词汇和短片语。
... See more This is indeed strange. If I don't get it wrong, I believe this languages file was done by some machine translation.
I also found Pidgin in all cases was translated as 洋泾浜, which is surely incorrect in this context.. I suggest a thorough review of the languages file.
Kevin I found this sentence in Kudoz interface:
KudoZ网络为译员和他人提供一个互动的架构，让大家互相帮助，完美翻译和解释词汇和短片语。
Maybe we could change 架构 and 短片语 to 框架 and 短句? Thanks.
Jianjun
Chinoise wrote:
Hi SCH Proofreaders and all,
Throughout the localized texts, the word "Chinese" (referring to "the Chinese language" here) has been translated as "中文汉语". It sounds a bit redundant to me . Would it be possible to change it to either “中文” or “汉语”？Any suggestions, folks?
Thanks in advance!
Regards,
Betty
[修改时间: 2006-10-20 21:59]
[Edited at 2006-10-21 02:34] ▲ Collapse
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| | LinguaCore | AI Translation at Your Fingertips
The underlying LLM technology of LinguaCore offers AI translations of unprecedented quality. Quick and simple. Add a human linguistic review at the end for expert-level quality at a fraction of the cost and time.
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