| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29] > | 一个英国人的汉译英试译（以此接得某大项目） Thread poster: Alan Wang
|
|---|
| Loss-in-weight scales for weighing/feeding (vs loss-of-weight gravimetry etc for moisture content) | Apr 3, 2009 |
Hello Yueyin
Weigher-feeder: Thank you. I saw your earlier diagram, but didn't examine it too closely. (Perhaps a flour or feed-mill might use this sort of machine. Did I see something in your refs about measuring out feed and supplements for chicken/pig rearing? Excellent.)
So, it's not talking about moisture content of hygroscopic powders then. Good. Yes, I see that the 'calcining process' of the raw coke drives off the moisture. And the other additives are dry, I guess. (Or perhaps ambient moisture content is not too important?)
The link which I referred to earlier seems quite relevant. There's even a flow-chart of a similar process. http://www.indiacarbonltd.com/images/flowchart.jpg I wonder, do you know what form the pitch-binder would be in? granules, perhaps? It looks as if all the ingredients, that is, the relevant coke fractions and additives plus the pitch, go through the loss-in-weight weigher/feeder. Is that your understanding?
另外问一下，真的有 doser/dosing 这个词吗? dose = 副 （一副药）
Lesley
[ Gravimetry etc here (p44):
http://books.google.com/books?id=CYELHT3DQuEC&pg=PA44&lpg=PA44&dq=drying%20of%20loose%20and%20particulate%20matters%20moisture%20content%20gravimetry&source=bl&ots=dO-CfrzWsQ&sig=KA5OS6Kc3u8LLEB1y6FF2lh0I2A&hl=en&ei=073VSZPeH6GItAOg8dWjCg&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=1
Earlier ‘india carbon' post here:
http://www.proz.com/forum/chinese/129475-一个英国人的汉译英试译（以此接得某大项目）-page4.html#1074622 ]
[Edited at 2009-04-04 01:43 GMT]
| | | | | | ysun 
United States
Local time: 15:07
English to Chinese
+ ...
wherestip wrote:
大家从不同方面出发, 说得都有一定道理. 我看是不是可以这样翻 ...
In the initial batch feeding stage, powders and asphalt that comply with the process requirements, (after being) measured by use of the loss-in-weight weighing method, are fed into the kneading cavity of the kneading device, (each in proportion) according to the specified mixing ratio.
当然还有很多不同的译法. 原来中选译文的译法便是其中之一. 我只是综合大家的不同意见加以归纳了一下. Yueyin 说得很对, 同样的意思可以有多种不同的说法, 没有绝对的对错. 关键是要尽量翻得准确无误, 符合真正的工艺流程, 并符合 target language 通常的惯用说法.
Steve,
你现在这样的译法当然也不错。但我认为，你原来译的那句就很好。尽管具体措词还可再讨论，但无论如何，“weighed and placed”没有错，这个基本句型没有错。如果有人想挑错，照样可以挑，因为你虽然把weighed去掉了，但又加上了 measured。“失重称量法”不是魔法，是需要靠具体的称量器和称量操作去实现的。没有一本翻译教程会规定原文没有的动作就不能加，必须一字不差地按照原文直译。
“需要称重”的粉料和沥青当然是要放入称量器。混捏机不是称量器，所以“把需要称重的粉料和沥青加入到混捏机的混捏腔内” 绝对是错误的。因此，原译文 “powders and asphalt that need weighing … are placed into the kneading cavity” 也绝对是错误的。你的译文就纠正了这一错误。本来这是件很简单的事情，是 common sense，即使没有任何工程技术背景的人，只要从逻辑上判断也应该可以明白。
| | | |
ysun wrote:
没有一本翻译教程会规定原文没有的动作就不能加，必须一字不差地按照原文直译。
不但没有任何翻译教程规定没有的动作就不能加，而且每一本翻译教程都会教授增译法和减译法，还有词类转换等翻译技巧，没有这些基本翻译技巧，翻译是没法做下去的。
当原文照译不能表达句子中隐含的意思的时候，就必须用增译法，把隐含的意思表达出来，当照原文直译显得累赘，不符合中文习惯，在清楚表达原文意思、不漏译的情况下，则必须进行调整，删除不必要的累赘之语，才会像是中国人说的话或写出来的东西。
词类转换也很重要，有时候不转换则无法组织句子。
[Edited at 2009-04-04 06:27 GMT]
| | |
|
|
|
nigerose
China
Local time: 04:07
Chinese to English
+ ...
Libin PhD wrote:
ysun wrote:
没有一本翻译教程会规定原文没有的动作就不能加，必须一字不差地按照原文直译。
不但没有任何翻译教程规定没有的动作就不能加，而且每一本翻译教程都会教授增译法和减译法，还有词类转换等翻译技巧，没有这些基本翻译技巧，翻译是没法做下去的。
当原文照译不能表达句子中隐含的意思的时候，就必须用增译法，把隐含的意思表达出来，当照原文直译显得累赘，不符合中文习惯，在清楚表达原文意思、不漏译的情况下，则必须进行调整，删除不必要的累赘之语，才会像是中国人说的话或写出来的东西。
词类转换也很重要，有时候不转换则无法组织句子。 [Edited at 2009-04-04 06:27 GMT]
增译法和减译法，还有词类转换，这些都是很基本但很重要的翻译技巧。
国内专利界强调“直译”，但未见有人总结出什么“直译”规则。所谓直译，可能是一种不动脑筋的偷懒办法。
| | | | wherestip
United States
Local time: 15:07
Chinese to English
+ ...
ysun wrote:
wherestip wrote:
大家从不同方面出发, 说得都有一定道理. 我看是不是可以这样翻 ...
In the initial batch feeding stage, powders and asphalt that comply with the process requirements, (after being) measured by use of the loss-in-weight weighing method, are fed into the kneading cavity of the kneading device, (each in proportion) according to the specified mixing ratio.
当然还有很多不同的译法. 原来中选译文的译法便是其中之一. 我只是综合大家的不同意见加以归纳了一下. Yueyin 说得很对, 同样的意思可以有多种不同的说法, 没有绝对的对错. 关键是要尽量翻得准确无误, 符合真正的工艺流程, 并符合 target language 通常的惯用说法.
Steve,
你现在这样的译法当然也不错。但我认为，你原来译的那句就很好。尽管具体措词还可再讨论，但无论如何，“weighed and placed”没有错，这个基本句型没有错。如果有人想挑错，照样可以挑，因为你虽然把weighed去掉了，但又加上了 measured。“失重称量法”不是魔法，是需要靠具体的称量器和称量操作去实现的。没有一本翻译教程会规定原文没有的动作就不能加，必须一字不差地按照原文直译。
“需要称重”的粉料和沥青当然是要放入称量器。混捏机不是称量器，所以“把需要称重的粉料和沥青加入到混捏机的混捏腔内” 绝对是错误的。因此，原译文 “powders and asphalt that need weighing … are placed into the kneading cavity” 也绝对是错误的。你的译文就纠正了这一错误。本来这是件很简单的事情，是 common sense，即使没有任何工程技术背景的人，只要从逻辑上判断也应该可以明白。
Yueyin,
我同意原句是有语病的. 像你所说, 应当是 "经称重" 才合乎实际工艺程序.
前面说过, 即便是在竞标测试的情况下, 我也不会出于原文句型只含一个动词而限制译文的措辞的. 使用从句 after being measured by use of the loss-in-weight weighing method 主要是为了避免你指出的 dangling participle 的问题. 你和 nigerose 在这个语法问题上的讨论很有意思. 原译文中 "making use of the loss-of-weight method ..." 虽然不能算错, 但放在整个句子中, 当初读起来我也觉得挺别扭 - 搁我是不会这样说的.
[Edited at 2009-04-04 19:41 GMT]
| | | | wherestip
United States
Local time: 15:07
Chinese to English
+ ...
| isahuang
Local time: 16:07
English to Chinese
+ ...
Libin PhD wrote:
ysun wrote:
没有一本翻译教程会规定原文没有的动作就不能加，必须一字不差地按照原文直译。
不但没有任何翻译教程规定没有的动作就不能加，而且每一本翻译教程都会教授增译法和减译法，还有词类转换等翻译技巧，没有这些基本翻译技巧，翻译是没法做下去的。
当原文照译不能表达句子中隐含的意思的时候，就必须用增译法，把隐含的意思表达出来，当照原文直译显得累赘，不符合中文习惯，在清楚表达原文意思、不漏译的情况下，则必须进行调整，删除不必要的累赘之语，才会像是中国人说的话或写出来的东西。
词类转换也很重要，有时候不转换则无法组织句子。 [Edited at 2009-04-04 06:27 GMT]
译者水平的高低，在这儿就看出来了。
| | |
|
|
|
jyuan_us
United States
Local time: 16:07
Member (2005)
English to Chinese
+ ...
| 翻译公司要求“直译”，是他们对客户要求的literal translation的误解 | Apr 4, 2009 |
nigerose wrote:
[
国内专利界强调“直译”，但未见有人总结出什么“直译”规则。所谓直译，可能是一种不动脑筋的偷懒办法。
我认为外国客户要求literal translation，其实是要求意思准确，并不是要你字对字翻译。他们怕翻译们在加词减词过程中掌握不好程度从而导致意思的错误，并不是说绝对不能加词或减词。
[Edited at 2009-04-04 15:15 GMT]
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 15:07
English to Chinese
+ ...
Libin PhD wrote:
ysun wrote:
没有一本翻译教程会规定原文没有的动作就不能加，必须一字不差地按照原文直译。
不但没有任何翻译教程规定没有的动作就不能加，而且每一本翻译教程都会教授增译法和减译法，还有词类转换等翻译技巧，没有这些基本翻译技巧，翻译是没法做下去的。
当原文照译不能表达句子中隐含的意思的时候，就必须用增译法，把隐含的意思表达出来，当照原文直译显得累赘，不符合中文习惯，在清楚表达原文意思、不漏译的情况下，则必须进行调整，删除不必要的累赘之语，才会像是中国人说的话或写出来的东西。
词类转换也很重要，有时候不转换则无法组织句子。 [Edited at 2009-04-04 06:27 GMT]
谢谢 Libin 和其他各位的意见。Libin 从翻译理论角度进一步阐明了此问题。“失重称量法”本身就隐含了“称量”的意思。可见，在译文中加上 “are weighed” 十分恰当。
我认为，原译者采用 “word-by-word” 的译法，很可能是因为不知“失重称量法”究竟是怎回事儿，不知究竟如何具体实施称量法，不理解“失重秤”与“混捏机”之间的关系，也不理解此工艺过程的前后顺序。因此，为了保险起见，他就采用了 “word-by-word” 的译法。
“Kneading cavity” 也是 “word-by-word” 的结果。我从一开始就看它别扭。行内的人通常会用 “kneading chamber”。我 Google了一下，发现极少有人用 “Kneading cavity”。只有三篇专利用此说法。仔细一看，还发现那三位申请者分别是中国人、日本人和德国人。把“混捏腔”译为 “kneading cavity” 很可能是机器翻译的结果。用 Google 翻译“混捏腔”，得到的结果就是 “kneading cavity”。那确实可以不动脑筋。
《郎文双解词典》关于chamber和cavity的定义分别如下：
Chamber - an enclosed space, esp. in a body or machine; 身体或机器之室.
Cavity - a hole or hollow space in a solid mass; 洞; 腔; 窝.
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 15:07
English to Chinese
+ ...
原文错了，他也就跟着错。只不过，他完全有理由推卸责任罢了。
ysun wrote:
我认为，原译者采用 “word-by-word” 的译法，很可能是因为不知“失重称量法”究竟是怎回事儿，不知究竟如何具体实施称量法，不理解“失重秤”与“混捏机”之间的关系，也不理解此工艺过程的前后顺序。因此，为了保险起见，他就采用了 “word-by-word” 的译法。
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 15:07
English to Chinese
+ ...
Apparently, the two sentences as shown below that I mentioned earlier in this discussion are incorrect.
“Standing on the tower, the whole town could be seen.”
“Standing on the top of the hill, the people below looked like small toys.”
| | |
|
|
|
wherestip
United States
Local time: 15:07
Chinese to English
+ ...
| rectifying dangling participles | Apr 4, 2009 |
ysun wrote:
Apparently, the two sentences as shown below that I mentioned earlier in this discussion are incorrect.
“Standing on the tower, the whole town could be seen.”
“Standing on the top of the hill, the people below looked like small toys.”
Agree, Yueyin. These sentences are flawed to say the least. There are definitely easy ways to rid the sentences of dangling participles. For example:
“Standing on the tower, I could see the whole town.”
“Standing on the top of the hill, to me the people below looked like small toys.”
[Edited at 2009-04-04 20:43 GMT]
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 15:07
English to Chinese
+ ...
| An alternative | Apr 5, 2009 |
Steve,
Yes, there are many ways to correct them. For example, the second sentence may also be changed into “When I was standing on the top of the hill, the people below looked like small toys.”
| | | | ysun
United States
Local time: 15:07
English to Chinese
+ ...
| To answer your question | Apr 5, 2009 |
Lesley,
I posted the above link just to illustrate how the loss-in-weight scale works with other equipment. As a matter of fact, the entire process may look very similar to the kneading process we’ve been talking about. It doesn’t matter whether the loss-in-weight scale works with the “supplements for chicken/pig rearing” or with other materials. What matters is whether the materials to be weighed are free flowing particles. Non-free flowing particles would stick to the walls of the loss-in-weight scaling system, causing inaccuracy. For example, the scale would work very well with shelled peanuts, but wouldn’t work at all with peanut butter. Apparently, the kneading system would need two loss-in-weight scales for the powders and asphalt, one for each. The powders and asphalt are not allowed to mix with each other before they come out of their respective loss-in-weight scales.
It seems that you’ve been to Lanzhou before. If so, you must have seen a large-scale petrochemical complex in the west of Lanzhou. The complex is a brilliant pearl on the Yellow River, and is the first large-scale petrochemical complex in China. If you visit a chemical fertilizer plant or a polymer resin plant in that company, you will see many loss-in-weight scales are working in some packaging systems of plastic resin pellets (i.e., beads) and chemical fertilizer pellets.
http://www.lzshc.com/Article/ShowArticle.asp?ArticleID=38
http://zhidao.baidu.com/question/33729023.html
[Edited at 2009-04-05 03:04 GMT]
| | | | | Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 11 12 13 14 15 16 17 18 19 20 21 22 23 24 25 26 27 28 29] > | To report site rules violations or get help, contact a site moderator: You can also contact site staff by submitting a support request » 一个英国人的汉译英试译（以此接得某大项目） | Trados Studio 2022 Freelance |
|---|
The leading translation software used by over 270,000 translators.
Designed with your feedback in mind, Trados Studio 2022 delivers an unrivalled, powerful desktop
and cloud solution, empowering you to work in the most efficient and cost-effective way.
More info » |
| | Trados Business Manager Lite |
|---|
Create customer quotes and invoices from within Trados Studio
Trados Business Manager Lite helps to simplify and speed up some of the daily tasks, such as invoicing and reporting, associated with running your freelance translation business.
More info » |
|
| | | | X Sign in to your ProZ.com account... | | | | | |
Login to reply/comment 
