Glossary entry (derived from question below)
French term or phrase:
charges horizontales
English translation:
charges for common parts
Added to glossary by
B D Finch
Aug 24, 2014 02:23
9 yrs ago
French term
charges horizontales
French to English
Law/Patents
Real Estate
The sale of a an apartment includes so many "millièmes attachés aux charges horizontales et de chauffage". So I'm familiar with the idea of a property in a condominium being allocated so many "tantièmes" or "millièmes" of the condominium charges. What I'm less sure about and have been unable to track down is a definition of what exactly is understood by "charges horizontales"-- I assume it's maybe something like "the charges that are payable by all properties, as opposed to certain contributions only made by some properties"? But can anybody shed any more light on this? Thanks!
Proposed translations
(English)
| 3 +1 | charges for common parts |
B D Finch
|
| 4 -2 | (BrE) commonhold > (AmE) condo > (Can/Oz) strata-title service charges |
Adrian MM. (X)
|
Change log
Aug 26, 2014 07:20: B D Finch Created KOG entry
Proposed translations
+1
9 hrs
Selected
charges for common parts
http://labs.paris.fr/commun/ogc/bmo/dbdl_delib.php?d=./Debat...
"Je voudrais dire aujourd’hui avec force que je confirme ce qu’a dit Jérôme COUMET, à savoir que l’objectif de la Ville dans le traitement des Olympiades est de faire en sorte que les charges horizontales, c’est-à-dire les charges qui incombent aux copropriétaires et qui ont trait à des espaces qui sont privés, mais d’utilisation publique, notamment la dalle, n’augmentent pas."
http://a06.apps.paris.fr/a06/jsp/site/Portal.jsp?page=ods-so...
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Note added at 9 hrs (2014-08-24 12:10:08 GMT)
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"la matrice cadastrale indique bien la villa comme étant un lot de la copro. l'ancien propriétaire du terrain est resté un lot pour béneficier d'un cos plus rentable. mais comme il avait aussi "rajouté" un local non prévu au réglememnt de copro et non prévu sur les plans et non enregistré au cadastre il avait choisi la "discétion" en ne participant pas aux AG en tant que lot de la villa.
nous ne demandons "que "la participation aux charges horizontales et non la totalité des charges générales. en fait la participation au jardin ,éclérage,voirie,assurance,syndic,.les propriétaires de la villa semblent ok sur cette répartition. "
http://www.universimmo.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22371
"Je voudrais dire aujourd’hui avec force que je confirme ce qu’a dit Jérôme COUMET, à savoir que l’objectif de la Ville dans le traitement des Olympiades est de faire en sorte que les charges horizontales, c’est-à-dire les charges qui incombent aux copropriétaires et qui ont trait à des espaces qui sont privés, mais d’utilisation publique, notamment la dalle, n’augmentent pas."
http://a06.apps.paris.fr/a06/jsp/site/Portal.jsp?page=ods-so...
--------------------------------------------------
Note added at 9 hrs (2014-08-24 12:10:08 GMT)
--------------------------------------------------
"la matrice cadastrale indique bien la villa comme étant un lot de la copro. l'ancien propriétaire du terrain est resté un lot pour béneficier d'un cos plus rentable. mais comme il avait aussi "rajouté" un local non prévu au réglememnt de copro et non prévu sur les plans et non enregistré au cadastre il avait choisi la "discétion" en ne participant pas aux AG en tant que lot de la villa.
nous ne demandons "que "la participation aux charges horizontales et non la totalité des charges générales. en fait la participation au jardin ,éclérage,voirie,assurance,syndic,.les propriétaires de la villa semblent ok sur cette répartition. "
http://www.universimmo.com/forum/topic.asp?TOPIC_ID=22371
Note from asker:
| Thanks to everyone's input -- it sounds like it's one of these cases where we have a typical use of the term, but not necessarily an official/legal definition. |
Peer comment(s):
| neutral |
Tony M
: V. interesting refs.! Sorry, not qualified to actually 'agree'
7 mins
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Not lowish confidence level because it is hard to find any references and this is the only one I found that came close to a definition.
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| agree |
AllegroTrans
: charges for communal/communally-owned parts
1 day 5 hrs
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Thanks AT
|
4 KudoZ points awarded for this answer.
-2
6 hrs
(BrE) commonhold > (AmE) condo > (Can/Oz) strata-title service charges
Fundamentally reflecting Tony K's analysis. Strata-title is arguably closest in tiered structure to the French source-term.
Peer comment(s):
| disagree |
B D Finch
: Though I think that you have correctly understood what sort of "copropriété" this means, "commonhold" would be a mistranslation. "Commonhold" is most frequently used in England and Wales for blocks of flats (vertical as well as horizontal divisions).
2 hrs
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I am saddened by your proposition. Though being vertically challenged myself, my weblink clearly refers to houses in FR being vertical splits. Also, never heard of vertical commonhold divisions, but I did refer to strata-title as my pref.
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| disagree |
AllegroTrans
: I have to agree with BD; this should not be "converted" to UK or US terminology, which may even not be comprehensible to an EN-speaker; the French "reality" needs to be retained
1 day 8 hrs
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Discussion
Définition de la copropriété horizontale
Par opposition à la copropriété verticale, on parle de copropriété horizontale pour un ensemble de maisons individuelles construites sur un terrain commun, divisé en zones de jouissance.
La copropriété horizontale est spécialement conçue pour régir un ensemble de maisons individuelles. On l'appelle aussi « copropriété pavillonnaire ».
http://copropriete.comprendrechoisir.com/comprendre/copropri...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commonhold
"Commonhold is a system of property ownership in England and Wales. It involves the indefinite freehold tenure of part of a multi-occupancy building (typically a flat) with shared ownership of and responsibility for common areas and services. It has features of the strata title and the condominium systems, which exist in Australia and the United States respectively. It was introduced by the Commonhold and Leasehold Reform Act 2002 as an alternative to leasehold, and was the first new type of legal estate to be introduced in English law since 1925."
I know absolutely nothing about the Australian and US strata title and condominium systems.