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Translation errors and the nasty problems they can cause
Thread poster: Viktoria Gimbe
Nico Rhodionoff
Nico Rhodionoff
India
Local time: 00:10
Russian to English
+ ...
Asker as "court of last resort" - is this the way to collect linguistic information? Mar 4, 2008

Respected colleagues!
Few weeks ago I have found this site in Internet and participate in discussions on drilling-related subjects just to see how it works.
Being second generation interpreter I have changed my horse and am drilling fluids engineer with Halliburton for last 7 years.

I know that it is a very tuff work to translate texts about drilling fluids due to exotic terminology and lack of reliable information. I see that plenty wrong terms have been selected by A
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Respected colleagues!
Few weeks ago I have found this site in Internet and participate in discussions on drilling-related subjects just to see how it works.
Being second generation interpreter I have changed my horse and am drilling fluids engineer with Halliburton for last 7 years.

I know that it is a very tuff work to translate texts about drilling fluids due to exotic terminology and lack of reliable information. I see that plenty wrong terms have been selected by Askers and due to that these misinterpretations have been accepted as exemplary glossary entries.

If Asker is not expert in a particular field, he/she can not judge about what is right and what is wrong, but decision about glossary entry is in his\her hand.

This is the way the Site multiplies misinterpretations and generates a “dictionary” helping users to make more and more translation mistakes.

My message is posted not to highlight my smartness comparing to other colleagues with less experience in drilling and drilling fluids. I post this message just to ask – is the way the Site accumulates linguistic information really a good one, if the Asker is the court of last resort?
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Daina Jauntirans
Daina Jauntirans  Identity Verified
Local time: 13:40
German to English
+ ...
Excellent point - new thread? Mar 4, 2008

FOH,

That's an excellent point. I think you should start a new thread about this topic and repost what you wrote. We have the same problem in the German/English financial KudoZ area.

***

Regarding the original topic on translation errors, I agree 100% with what Heike said - very well put. We aren't "on the inside," but are still expected to produce a perfect document quickly as if we had been. That is one reason I make sure to query inconsistencies, unclear
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FOH,

That's an excellent point. I think you should start a new thread about this topic and repost what you wrote. We have the same problem in the German/English financial KudoZ area.

***

Regarding the original topic on translation errors, I agree 100% with what Heike said - very well put. We aren't "on the inside," but are still expected to produce a perfect document quickly as if we had been. That is one reason I make sure to query inconsistencies, unclear terms or phrasing, etc. with my customers. They can expect a list of questions and comments with almost every translation except the most simple, and I think that's the way it should be. I can't and shouldn't guess what the author meant in many cases and besides that, authors make mistakes, too. Pulling the author/expert back in this way helps ensure that the text will be as clear and correct as possible in getting across the desired message. My best customers are the ones who view translation as a group process and appreciate that these queries and suggestions are going to make for a better quality translation.

Here is another good article on a related topic - risk analysis and translation (I have posted this before on these forums):
Anthony Pym - Text and Risk in Translation
http://www.tinet.org/~apym/on-line/translation/risk_analysis.pdf
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Riccardo Schiaffino
Riccardo Schiaffino  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:40
Member (2003)
English to Italian
+ ...
Don't be so sure Mar 6, 2008

Heinrich Pesch wrote:

No technical writer or translator can be hold responsible for errors. Only the issuer of the text is responsible, and they have insurance.



The fact that the ultimate issuer of the text is liable for damages does not mean that they are the only people liable. Liability cascades back to the agency who handled the translation and even the translators, and an actual trial would eventually determine how much each party is to blame.

While I agree that the possibility that translators be sued for their errors is fairly remote, I don't think that such a sweeping statement as "No translator can be held responsible for errors" is helpful.

I believe that in most jurisdictions translators could be held liable for their errors, and the only thing that has prevented actual lawsuit for damages against translators is the unlikelihood to recover significant amounts from them (no "deep pocket" in our profession).


 
Dr. Jody Byrne (X)
Dr. Jody Byrne (X)  Identity Verified
United Kingdom
Local time: 18:40
German to English
+ ...
Just to clarify... Mar 12, 2008

Hi everyone,
I'm glad to see that my paper is generating so much debate. That's precisely what I intended to do when I wrote it although it was primarily aimed at academics who generally don't understand what us professional translators have to face. I'm a professional translator and have been for 11 years now. I've been a translator for a lot longer than I've been an academic, so Heinrich's slightly snippy reference to "translation professors" doesn't apply to me - I do actually know what
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Hi everyone,
I'm glad to see that my paper is generating so much debate. That's precisely what I intended to do when I wrote it although it was primarily aimed at academics who generally don't understand what us professional translators have to face. I'm a professional translator and have been for 11 years now. I've been a translator for a lot longer than I've been an academic, so Heinrich's slightly snippy reference to "translation professors" doesn't apply to me - I do actually know what I'm talking about. My interest in law comes from asking myself the question "What would happen if I got a translation spectacularly wrong?". Nowadays it seems everybody is getting sued for even the slightest act that could be regarded, however tenuously, as negligent.

Anyway, I just thought I'd respond to this discussion to make myself known, to thank you for your largely positive comments and to shed a little light on what I think may be misinterpretations of my paper. With regard to Tatty's (and others) comments regarding the issue of injury and wounding, I have to point out that these suggestions are not my own, they are taken from the judge's ruling in the King (AP) vs. Bristow Helicopters case from 2002. They are not my translations. My working languages are German and Spanish, not French so if you have any problems with the translations, Lord Steyn is the person to whom your ire should be directed

Also, Heinrich claims that the issuer is the sole entity responsible in cases of negligence or liability. While this may be theoretically true, how often have you heard of a law suit being served in which everyone from, let's say, the plastic surgeon, the anaesthetist, the people who manufacture the silicone boob implants to the cleaner who didn't scrub the operating theatre properly to the receptionist whose handwriting was a little scrawled and the surgeons great-grandmother were named as co-defendants? It happens all the time! Usually everyone who can possibly be linked in some way to the negligent act is chased by plaintiffs. So I would have to agree with Riccardo. There is also the possibility that if the issuer can show that it has followed all normal practices, taken all reasonable precautions, and performed all checks but harm was still nevertheless caused, the finger of blame points at the translator and/or agency. Even if the issuer was found liable and had to pay damages, standard practice, at least in my part of the world is for the issuer (or more probably the issuer's insurer) to pursue, in this case, the translator to recoup the damages.

One more thing from Heinrich's comments that I could take offence at if I were in any way a sensitive soul (“These professors are so funny...those translation professors”): what's wrong with saying no translator has, to my knowledge, ever been found liable but there is still the risk? That's just sensible advice. I'm highlighting a theoretical possibility, that's all and I'm not saying anything more than that and I'm certainly not scare-mongering. This kind of information is good to know. That's the whole point of learning, research and indeed being a translator - we're supposed to be collectors of facts and odd bits of knowledge.

In response to Tatty's comments about me not having a degree in law, you're absolutely right. I'm not an expert and while there may be various explanations and possible interpretations of the translation etc. the fact remains that the English translation (not the French text) is supposed to serve as the basis for an English law, it is supposed to be authoritative and render consulting the original French text unnecessary. For whatever reason, the English translation is not capable of replacing the French text even though that was the whole point in producing it. The problems I mention are based on an actual case where a judge highlighted problems with the translation. So while I may not be a legal expert with the requisite qualifications to address the issues you mention, the senior judge who presided in the case is. And in his opinion, there is a problem with the translation. There's not much point in coulda-shoulda comments, the fact is that the translation is regarded as problematic by the people who use it and I am simply reporting that fact.

To clarify Heike's query regarding the issue of a less qualified translator being less liable than a more qualified expert, you're partly right. The law actually states that if a translator *claims* to be an expert, then they will be judged more harshly than someone who makes no such claim. It's not a distinction of what you know, but what you claim to know (and be able to do).

Finally, in response to Anne's queries about my justification/explanation for the Geruch/smell/steam/smoke issue I have to admit that I was trying to be kind to the translator in question. I don't think there's any excuse for such a stupid mistake but in academic writing, it's just not polite to come straight out and call someone an incompetent idiot. When writing for academic journals you're supposed to adopt as neutral and objective position as possible, offering possible explanations and justifications even when no sane person would do so. The explanation I gave, as flimsy as it is, is just me trying to be objective and not saying what I really think.

Anyway, I hope I haven't come across as petulant here... I love debate, that's the whole point in writing these papers. But the paper was primarily aimed at those theorists who haven't a clue about real translation. What I was trying to do was get them to realise that translation isn't some nice relaxing hobby where you get to translate some obscure poetry at your leisure over the course of a couple of years. It's a real job carried out by dedicated professionals (usually!) and that it's hard. To add to the hardship we face we have the possibility of litigation (however remote) if we make a mess of a text. That's all.

All the best,
Jody

[Edited at 2008-03-12 11:46]

[Edited at 2008-03-12 11:51]

[Edited at 2008-03-12 12:03]

[Edited at 2008-03-12 12:05]

[Edited at 2008-03-12 12:10]

[Edited at 2008-03-12 12:22]

[Edited at 2008-03-12 12:23]
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Michael Jones
Michael Jones  Identity Verified
Local time: 04:40
Italian to English
+ ...
A lawyer's view Mar 16, 2008

Well done, Jody. If you are not a lawyer, your research would qualify you for excellent marks in any law school.
Actually, what I found most surprising was that you found so few cases. Paradoxically, it might mean that society at large doesn't expect too much of us poor multilingual hacks. If true, too sad.
I started professional life as a court interpreter, then became a lawyer and kept up some translating on the side, and now that I am getting older I am thinking of moving away fro
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Well done, Jody. If you are not a lawyer, your research would qualify you for excellent marks in any law school.
Actually, what I found most surprising was that you found so few cases. Paradoxically, it might mean that society at large doesn't expect too much of us poor multilingual hacks. If true, too sad.
I started professional life as a court interpreter, then became a lawyer and kept up some translating on the side, and now that I am getting older I am thinking of moving away from legal practice and more towards translating as my main source of income.
As a lawyer I have always paid for professional indemnity insurance, which is compulsory in my country as in most. I consider it a business expense like rent, wages or telephone, and of course I pass it on to my clients. As a translator I can get extensive coverage for next to nothing -- again, maybe because like planet Earth in the "Hitchhiker's Guide to the Galaxy" we are considered "mostly harmless".
If we value our work, we should also respect its potential to do good or harm.
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langalliance
langalliance  Identity Verified
United States
Local time: 12:40
Amharic to English
+ ...
Outrageous Legal Translation Errors Jun 26, 2017

On a lighter note, check out "Legal Translations: Seven Outrageous Cases Where Translation Errors Changed Lives" at https://www.languagealliance.com/blog/legal-translations-seven-outrageous-cases-where-translation-errors-changed-lives/

 
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